hey bros and bras! ;-)

so, please lend me your ear... i don't know if this is normal or what (i think it is not).

last cycle: test 500mg/week, deca 400mg/week, closed it out with some tbol. ran HCG since week 5. PCT was 2 weeks arimdex (all i had), with 5 weeks of tribulus, clomid, and nolva. last shot was about december 10.

fast forward SEVEN WEEKS. get my blood drawn last thursday (2/1). test count is only 100! i feel fine, not horny really, i can and have gotten it up a number of times, but yeah, sex isn't on my mind really at all. hmmm, weird (NOT normal). I stopped the tribulus and everything about 2-2.5 weeks ago at the end of pct. my 'beanbag' seems like it is normal (despite the cold weather).

is this too soon (7 weeks post cycle) to care about my bloodwork w/r/t test levels? on the plus side, my liver, kidneys, and cholesterol are a-okay. i want to get back on cycle , but no go until i get this ironed out.

so my doc wants me to go see an endocrinologist, but i want to try to fix this myself first. HERE is the plan AND my questions:

1250iu HCG EVERY OTHER DAY for 3 weeks (5000iu/week).
5-6 grams tribulus every day for 4 weeks.
10mg nolva for 10 days (all i have at the moment).

QUESTIONS (please help!):

1) i also have maybe 15-20 pills of cabaser... should i bother incorporating that? i don't see that it will help with test levels, but i could be wrong.

2) is this HCG plan an okay idea? from what i've read, it seems like i need to hit it hard and get off of it ASAP...

3) any other ideas? ;-)


thanks guys, i'll let ya know how it pans out 4 weeks from now.

I think you should get your hands on some more Clomid. Run 500iu HCG eod for 2 weeks while running 50mg of Clomid and 5g of Tribulus a day. Continue the Clomid for another 2 weeks after you finish the HCG and stay on the Tribulus for a while. This isn't expert advice but it worked for me.

I would go to the endocrinologist Doc first. I was told by my endocrinologist that a lot of things can affect test levels. You may want to make sure its nothing bad that you would regret not checking out first. I just had my checked I have not used in almost a year and my total was 171 and my free was 9.4 . I have had two doctor visits since and have given almost 18vials ( lots of tests ) of blood and they still don't know why I am low. The doc said that he feels because I was 36yrs old and road hard and put up wet thats his best explanation. I now have to do a cat scan to see if somethings wrong. He could not give me an MRI because I have to much metal fragments in my body. I then asked If the cat scan show nothing then what. He was very reluctant to say I might qualify for low doses of test. With all that I have went through I still feel glad that I know nothing serious is wrong. GO TO THE DOC

thanks man, i think you're right, i'll call the endo tomorrow.

going to go ahead and order more clomid just in case...

any other thoughts out there? definitely listening. thanks, all.

just fyi - i shoulda mentioned earlier, i'm 30 yrs old.

just ordered some more clomid and hcg... should have the trib on hand in 2 days. already shot 1250iu hcg this eve and will be repeating that eod or every third day (not sure yet).

going to see endo whenever he can get me in.

i'm sure everything will pan out, it always does.

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but i seem to remember reading that HCG should be stopped just prior to PCT. Reason being is that it actually supresses your natural test levels. I'm not 100% on this, so if somebody can verify or correct me please do...

If i'm right then, that could be the reason your levels were low in the first place...

Bump Visions, check the post below for solid info.

Don't take too many different things at the same time because it can give mixed signals to the leydig cells and they can stop responding...

Your 1250ius is ok... I would recommend 1500ius e3d for 3 shots then take 500ius e3d for 5 more shots and that should be good for the HCG cause I think you will respond well... (not eod because shots too soon may shut the testies back down,,, yes clinical studies do it but why risk it... after each shot the output peaks in 72hrs so thats why I recommend e3d to be safe and it will still be very effective...

HCG mimics LH and FSH so while you are on it you are suppressing LH and this is why you then get on 100mg Clomid ed for 2-3 weeks cause it increases LH and FSH... At the same time you take Clomid you should take an AI like Aromasin because clomid raises estrogens above normal which can shut you down after you stop it... Plus AI's raise test prodution by at least 50% alone by lowering estrogen which triggers test production...

I wouldn't mix in Tribuilus or other stuff cause it can be counter productive if the leydig cells get over stimulated cause that makes them shut down...

thank you, visions!!!!

i do remember reading how one's PCT might have to be repeated, so i am not entirely surprised.

quick question: i won't have the clomid for another 1-2 weeks or so. should i wait on the HCG and do the HCG+clomid at the same time, or should I start the HCG now and start the clomid when i get it?

just curious if that matters, really.

i will be ordering aromasin just as soon as WU stops complaining about money xfers to the countries i want to send to... wtf... stupid WU.

thank you again, sir!! you are a veritable treasure trove of valuable information. (uh oh, i think you can tell by the way i'm talking that my test levels are too low. ;-P )

I did the same thing ran HCG Clomid and Nolvadex post Tren cycle. Got my blood drawn a month after stopping the ancillary drugs and got a TT (Total Testosterone) of 17! I felt fine chilled out for a bit and waited another 2 months and it was back in the 500's. I'd wait to run another cycle though. You can run one but it won't be as effective. And you might compramise your levels climbing back up properly.